A Return To Pinjarra

bookielover · January 2

Riders,

That's pretty sad there being no bookie at Pinjarra. It's usually a good meeting crowd wise.

As far as there being no tote on course in Victoria , the clubs both racing, mainly the provincial ones, all trotting and greyhounds, have to pay the TAB if they want operators working there. That has come in due to the lack of on course patrons.

If a punter keeps backing odds on favourites, over time , it's a short way to the poorhouse. Yes, you'll occasionally get a Winx or a Black Caviar who win multiple races in a row, but they only win one at a time and in between their wins there will be plenty of odds on faves who don't win.

My old man's biggest wins on races involved odds on favourites. Some might recall Stainvita at Sandown ridden by Roy Higgins which started at 1/4 and broke down in the straight when five lengths in front. He won 50 grand on that and it was a midweek meeting from memory. And a 2/7 chance at the valley which didn't run a place in a field of 7, won about the same on that, also a midweek meeting. A mate of mine took 3000/21000 cash, the place with place bookie Jack Pugh, it had to run one two. Pugh worked upstairs in the market places its called. My mate walked down the stairs in a state of complete shock. So much so he walked into a pole and knocked himself out. He learned his lesson and never had another place bet again. Was trained by Geoff Murphy but I can't remember its name.

Dad's biggest ever win on a single race involving an odds on favourite, was at Flemington in the Australian Cup. The clash between Vo Rogue and Bonecrusher. Vo opened at 4/6 Bonecrusher at 7/4. My old man drew a great stand around the middle of the rails and,as soon as he went up, went 9/10 and 9/4 the two horses and got swamped. It was the most frenetic ten minutes of betting with him that I have ever seen. He got around 80,000 out of Vo and the same out of Bone. At least half the 160,000 plus was in cash. Those were the days. Dandy Andy won at 33/1. My dad had been told by a smart bloke that the track was off and both wouldn't handle it. I can't recall Vo's Sp, but it didn't start odds on. I'm pretty sure Bone started at 3/1.

But, he did lose around 150,000 on Manikato, taking it on in-five successive wins of the William Reid Stakes. Having said that, I reckon every bookie around Australia, would love 3 odds on chances every week, in a 9-10 race program.

The only proviso is what Bill Waterhouse told my dad in1960. Don't take on champions. But dad couldn't help himself. Bill would lay every outsider in races where a champion was odds on, and he won plenty over the years laying the outsiders. Mind you, when he did take a champion on at odds on, he had a lot in his favour. Laying the odds on favourites at the trots were his specialty. He worked hot, but unlike his son, was brilliant at it.

psycho · January 2

Bookie on a personal note I have NEVER been to Pinjarra without a bookmaker being on course, it may have happened occasionally but I seriously doubt it unless only 1 was going to field and something happened to him on the day (sickness, breakdown etc)

bookielover · January 2

Psycho, you would have to assume unless someone has different information, that there was an issue preventing the Mckormacks from working there. Mind you, Lindsay, I don't know his last name, who operates under the name Styleform bookmaking, would also work there regularly.

Which leads me to ask you because I'm not in WA, has Lindsay given it away? According to a mate who was at the carnival, 7 bookies worked in the main ring and he wasn't one of them.

psycho · January 2

bookielover said:
Psycho, you would have to assume unless someone has different information, that there was an issue preventing the Mckormacks from working there. Mind you, Lindsay, I don't know his last name, who operates under the name Styleform bookmaking, would also work there regularly.

Which leads me to ask you because I'm not in WA, has Lindsay given it away? According to a mate who was at the carnival, 7 bookies worked in the main ring and he wasn't one of them.

Lindsay passed away earlier this year, may he RIP

spinking · January 2

I have been to Pinjarra on there big days and getting mobile coverage is almost impossible. Even after getting the courses wifi password. So at times hard to get account betting

SLIPPERGOLDEN · January 2

Please excuse my ignorance but which bookmaker passed away recently?

bookielover · January 3

So very sorry to hear that Psycho. I had a few bets with him over the years when visiting Perth and to me, he seemed like a nice bloke. I would have put his age as late 60's when I last saw him 2022. So he's passed away too young. I'm actually surprised that no one posted it here when it happened. He was a fixture on track for a very long time. Obviously there is/was no one in the family prepared to carry on the business.

On a broader note, that's the problem in states like WA, SA in particular, when bookies either turn it up or pass away, no one replaces them.

And Slip, he operated on course under the business name Styleform.

Ngawyni · January 3

SLIPPERGOLDEN said:
Please excuse my ignorance but which bookmaker passed away recently?

Lindsay Severn passed in September. He was 74. The club named a race after him in October.

SLIPPERGOLDEN · January 3

Thank you for the update BL and Ngawyni

Ridersonthestorm33 · January 3

Oh Fixed Odds Betting - is what FOB means how would i not know that so obvious still couldn’t get it. I’ll let myself out.

Ridersonthestorm33 · January 3

Wow bookie odds on favourites that was very interesting to read. Thank you.

One of my first memories of a big odds on bettor was picking up the afternoon paper one day and reading about a NSW punter - “The Fireman.”

From what recall he was backing a lot of odds on favourites in the 2 yr old races possibly TJ Smith runners a few times and they were all winning.

Soon after the wheels had turned - not saying anything nefarious but suddenly the odds on favourite 2 yr old he’s loaded up on a speed machine misses the kick, or veers off on the corner, gets impeded that type of thing.

Those things can happen in racing but thought that’s a bit of a coincidence just the same and he was soon gone.

Also do you know why the nickname “The Fireman ?”

Remember saying to my dad have a look at this article about him winning so much on the short priced runners and he didn’t say much but next time went to the races said have a look here…“this is the bookies car park and over here is the punters car park.”

Didn’t listen hard enough but point taken.

Who would credit Manikato could win that race 5 times in a row twice is hard enough, three times okay that’s an effort, but 4 and then 5 times is incredulous. Royal Snack possibly for George Hanlon won a Moe Cup 4 or 5 times in a row from memory.

One of the more famous ones read about was Vain who was 1/40 or something like that - and got rolled.

Recall when Placid Arc came back from Melbourne after winning the Oakleigh Plate, Lightning and Newmarket Handicaps was around 2/7 and 1/3 at Ascot first run back from Melbourne - rolled.

With Vain 1/40 and someone wants 80,000 to win just 2,000 and if you’re a well off bookmaker risking a “lousy” $2000 but the slight chance of a massive $80,000 collect. Hell yeah I can understand why bookmakers like odds on pops.

Also what was your fathers nerves like - that’s serious money, the old heart would be racing I’d imagine.

Old fashioned luck probably plays a big part too - heads up heads down in photos or who’d credit Roy Higgins would drop his hands on Hyperno that time in the Moonee Valley Cup. Things like that, the variables.

psycho · January 3

The firemam got his name because he WAS a fireman, also think some of the nickname came from his love of backing horses in the RED

Ridersonthestorm33 · January 3

***And sorry not Vain beaten at 1/40 it was Ajax***

Ridersonthestorm33 · January 4

Guess the other thing with bookmaking as you touched on Bookie is that sometimes the favourite winning is not your worst result ?

Recall hearing of a late 5k bet on Luckygray at 20/1 before won his second Railway Stakes which took the book from a great result if wins to a not so good one.

Balancing the figures must have needed to be very alert especially back in those days. A late 5k bet each way on something at 7/1 could turn the favourite into a good result ? And back then you seemed to accept and take anyone on, even late in betting.

The great fill ups must be when the “Dandy Andy’s”win - 4 little bets taken on them and 5 pages on Bonecrusher and Vo Rogue.

bookielover · January 8

Riders,

Eddie Birchley aka the fireman first appeared in Melbourne at Flemington when he had 200,000 cash on a horse called caboul at 1/6. My old man bet him 5,000/ 30,000. He went to 4 other bookies to have the rest on.

Where he stuffed himself was going to Sydney where the bookies like Terry Page, Waterhouse etc, bet bigger than in Melbourne and one or both would take his bet in one hit. The problem for him was that they had the jockeys pull up the horses he was backing and that sent him to the wall. From memory, I think he complained to the stewards and the media, but it didn't help him and he went bust.

He spent his last years in a retirement home but still went to the local

Pubtab every day to have a bet.

SLIPPERGOLDEN · January 8

bookielover said:
From memory, I think he complained to the stewards and the media, but it didn't help him and he went bust.

That is how I recall it...Basically The Fireman was told to go to blazes ;))

Ridersonthestorm33 · January 8

^^Hahahaha.

Ridersonthestorm33 · January 8

Slip you would’ve liked that headline from the Daily News in 1987 after Pat Cash defeated Ivan Lendl to win Wimbledon.

Cash Beats A Czech.

Yes okay fair enough…3 days then went by…oh of course…i get it.

Yes especially in 1987 Cash always did beat a cheque.

carey · January 9

bookielover said:
Riders,
Eddie Birchley aka the fireman first appeared in Melbourne at Flemington when he had 200,000 cash on a horse called caboul at 1/6. My old man bet him 5,000/ 30,000. He went to 4 other bookies to have the rest on.
Where he stuffed himself was going to Sydney where the bookies like Terry Page, Waterhouse etc, bet bigger than in Melbourne and one or both would take his bet in one hit. The problem for him was that they had the jockeys pull up the horses he was backing and that sent him to the wall. From memory, I think he complained to the stewards and the media, but it didn't help him and he went bust.

He spent his last years in a retirement home but still went to the local
Pubtab every day to have a bet.

I saw Birchley one day at Moonee Valley races.

He was there to back Caboul too(pretty sure according to my memory!)

He attracted a big crowd, just watching him removing great wads of 50's or 100's from every part of his body.

psycho · January 9

carey said:

bookielover said:
Riders,
Eddie Birchley aka the fireman first appeared in Melbourne at Flemington when he had 200,000 cash on a horse called caboul at 1/6. My old man bet him 5,000/ 30,000. He went to 4 other bookies to have the rest on.
Where he stuffed himself was going to Sydney where the bookies like Terry Page, Waterhouse etc, bet bigger than in Melbourne and one or both would take his bet in one hit. The problem for him was that they had the jockeys pull up the horses he was backing and that sent him to the wall. From memory, I think he complained to the stewards and the media, but it didn't help him and he went bust.

He spent his last years in a retirement home but still went to the local
Pubtab every day to have a bet.
I saw Birchley one day at Moonee Valley races.
He was there to back Caboul too(pretty sure according to my memory!)
He attracted a big crowd, just watching him removing great wads of 50's or 100's from every part of his body.

Caboul if I remember was racing in the 70s but $100 notes came into circulation in the 80s, would have meant he had a bucket load of 50s I guess :))

carey · January 9

psycho said:

carey said:

bookielover said:
Riders,
Eddie Birchley aka the fireman first appeared in Melbourne at Flemington when he had 200,000 cash on a horse called caboul at 1/6. My old man bet him 5,000/ 30,000. He went to 4 other bookies to have the rest on.
Where he stuffed himself was going to Sydney where the bookies like Terry Page, Waterhouse etc, bet bigger than in Melbourne and one or both would take his bet in one hit. The problem for him was that they had the jockeys pull up the horses he was backing and that sent him to the wall. From memory, I think he complained to the stewards and the media, but it didn't help him and he went bust.

He spent his last years in a retirement home but still went to the local
Pubtab every day to have a bet.
I saw Birchley one day at Moonee Valley races.
He was there to back Caboul too(pretty sure according to my memory!)
He attracted a big crowd, just watching him removing great wads of 50's or 100's from every part of his body.

Caboul if I remember was racing in the 70s but $100 notes came into circulation in the 80s, would have meant he had a bucket load of 50s I guess :))

Caboul was Tony Lopes who I think had Chicquita Lodge at Flemington

It could have been twenties or whatever, the point was he had wads all over his persona, and it was noticeable.

He also had an ill fitting tartan suit.
Normally I would not notice things like that, but he stood out.

carey · January 9

Plus I only knew his name because his betting made the papers(probably Jack Elliot in the Herald or Roylance in the Sporting Globe), or else I would have had no idea who he was.

Ridersonthestorm33 · January 10

Ah the Sporting Globe can remember that paper came out once a week we could buy it in Perth think perhaps hit the news agency on a Tuesday afternoon or Wednesday morning had all the track work scribes and information too, they had the photo results from the previous couple of meetings and in 3 different places around the 800 metre mark the corner and the finish - and with a star on horses to follow from memory. Pink page on the outside - it was a very good paper.

Talking of form guides can recall Shane Templeton say on radio with the first starters if he knew nothing about them say for instance the 2 yr olds that hadn’t trialled he’d draw what looked like a little bear with two eyes peering into the distance - the guy assembling the comments for the paper immediately knew what that meant for the form guide comment “Bears watching.”

G'day Punter!

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