Railway Protest

oscarwildy · January 2012

When the stewards told Berry to lodge a protest you weren't surprised it was upheld. In my opinion the winner always going better than Berry's mount in the run to the post and would still have won despite the interference.

Semipropunter · January 2012

said:

said:

said:

said:
Well well the magic millions upheld protest was much worse, :?
why was it much worse??

you may not agree with the decision, BUT, at least they had the vision to enable them to come to their decision.
wa stewards did it with no such help.
head on vision same same as Perth has :wink:
well i'll break my rule and respond to you......you don't know what you're talking about.
there was no problem seeing what happened on the gold coast, they had vision showing what happened, whether the decision was right or not is a different topic
there was no vision in wa that showed what happened(head on or otherwise)

The interference happened in the home straight and that's why they had head on vision.

Semipropunter · January 2012

said:
Berry played Rawiller like a teacher to a student

Yep loved the porkie he told when Nash asked him did he stop riding at any stage? He said he put the whip away at the 200m. They go well past the 100m mark (blue paint on the inside rail) and Berry is still using his whip until just before the post- probably closer to the 25m mark when he puts his whip away.

Semipropunter · January 2012

said:

said:
Well well the magic millions upheld protest was much worse, :?
why was it much worse??

you may not agree with the decision, BUT, at least they had the vision to enable them to come to their decision.
wa stewards did it with no such help.

Luckygray should have beaten He's Remarkable on the track, can you say that about Driefontein? He was tiring- Berry would not have got anything else out of his horse had he used the whip anyway, hands and heels would have been the go. The difference in prizemoney($840,000) is the reason for the protest and Berry gets an extra $42k of that.

carey · January 2012

said:
When the stewards told Berry to lodge a protest you weren't surprised it was upheld. In my opinion the winner always going better than Berry's mount in the run to the post and would still have won despite the interference.

i dunno how it ensued, but if berry did not want to protest, then the stewards had to, or they would not be doing their job properly.

carey · January 2012

said:

said:

said:
Well well the magic millions upheld protest was much worse, :?
why was it much worse??

you may not agree with the decision, BUT, at least they had the vision to enable them to come to their decision.
wa stewards did it with no such help.
Luckygray should have beaten He's Remarkable on the track, can you say that about Driefontein? He was tiring- Berry would not have got anything else out of his horse had he used the whip anyway, hands and heels would have been the go. The difference in prizemoney($840,000) is the reason for the protest and Berry gets an extra $42k of that.

if lucky gray wins or not is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT, because stewards had no evidence that he's remarkable was the cause.
as for the protest today, i'm not sure which way it should have went, but rawiller never stopped riding despite going sideways, which probably counted against him.
i certainly don't think it's remotely as controversial as the wa one.

Semipropunter · January 2012

said:

said:

said:

said:
Well well the magic millions upheld protest was much worse, :?
why was it much worse??

you may not agree with the decision, BUT, at least they had the vision to enable them to come to their decision.
wa stewards did it with no such help.
Luckygray should have beaten He's Remarkable on the track, can you say that about Driefontein? He was tiring- Berry would not have got anything else out of his horse had he used the whip anyway, hands and heels would have been the go. The difference in prizemoney($840,000) is the reason for the protest and Berry gets an extra $42k of that.
if lucky gray wins or not is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT, because stewards had no evidence that he's remarkable was the cause.
as for the protest today, i'm not sure which way it should have went, but rawiller never stopped riding despite going sideways, which probably counted against him.
i certainly don't think it's remotely as controversial as the wa one.

Paul Harvey said McEvoy shifted out in front of him and McEvoy himself admitted he did. Case closed. You can see the shift from the side on shot. It's not as conclusive as a head on view but it's good enough imo. Berry said he put his whip away at the 200m mark in the MM. That was a lie, but neither Nash, nor the owners' representative of No Looking Back pointed that out.

carey · January 2012

said:

said:

said:

said:

said:
Well well the magic millions upheld protest was much worse, :?
why was it much worse??

you may not agree with the decision, BUT, at least they had the vision to enable them to come to their decision.
wa stewards did it with no such help.
Luckygray should have beaten He's Remarkable on the track, can you say that about Driefontein? He was tiring- Berry would not have got anything else out of his horse had he used the whip anyway, hands and heels would have been the go. The difference in prizemoney($840,000) is the reason for the protest and Berry gets an extra $42k of that.
if lucky gray wins or not is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT, because stewards had no evidence that he's remarkable was the cause.
as for the protest today, i'm not sure which way it should have went, but rawiller never stopped riding despite going sideways, which probably counted against him.
i certainly don't think it's remotely as controversial as the wa one.
Paul Harvey said McEvoy shifted out in front of him and McEvoy himself admitted he did. Case closed. You can see the shift from the side on shot. It's not as conclusive as a head on view but it's good enough imo. Berry said he put his whip away at the 200m mark in the MM. That was a lie, but neither Nash, nor the owners' representative of No Looking Back pointed that out.

im not intersted in the gold coast one, but the perth one is VERY interesting and very wrong.
what harvey said is irrelevant, because wtf would you expect him to say.
mcevoy is another case and he was probably the cause of the protest being upheld, but i'm sure he was confused.
he did shift out and it probably warranted a suspension, BUT the damage to ws occurred prior to that.
i will also say that anybody that says they could see what happened in perth is a LIAR

Semipropunter · January 2012

said:

said:

said:

said:

said:

said:
Well well the magic millions upheld protest was much worse, :?
why was it much worse??

you may not agree with the decision, BUT, at least they had the vision to enable them to come to their decision.
wa stewards did it with no such help.
Luckygray should have beaten He's Remarkable on the track, can you say that about Driefontein? He was tiring- Berry would not have got anything else out of his horse had he used the whip anyway, hands and heels would have been the go. The difference in prizemoney($840,000) is the reason for the protest and Berry gets an extra $42k of that.
if lucky gray wins or not is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT, because stewards had no evidence that he's remarkable was the cause.
as for the protest today, i'm not sure which way it should have went, but rawiller never stopped riding despite going sideways, which probably counted against him.
i certainly don't think it's remotely as controversial as the wa one.
Paul Harvey said McEvoy shifted out in front of him and McEvoy himself admitted he did. Case closed. You can see the shift from the side on shot. It's not as conclusive as a head on view but it's good enough imo. Berry said he put his whip away at the 200m mark in the MM. That was a lie, but neither Nash, nor the owners' representative of No Looking Back pointed that out.
im not intersted in the gold coast one, but the perth one is VERY interesting and very wrong.
what harvey said is irrelevant, because wtf would you expect him to say.
mcevoy is another case and he was probably the cause of the protest being upheld, but i'm sure he was confused.
he did shift out and it probably warranted a suspension, BUT the damage to ws occurred prior to that.
i will also say that anybody that says they could see what happened in perth is a LIAR

Well you can call me a liar then I'm fine with that. I backed Luckygray and was disapponted before the protest was fired in. I didn't have a bet today on the MM, but I'm adamant that was the wrong decision.

carey · January 2012

if you reckon you saw it then YOU ARE A LIAR......100%

Dark · January 2012

said:

Paul Harvey said McEvoy shifted out in front of him and McEvoy himself admitted he did. Case closed. You can see the shift from the side on shot. It's not as conclusive as a head on view but it's good enough imo. Berry said he put his whip away at the 200m mark in the MM. That was a lie, but neither Nash, nor the owners' representative of No Looking Back pointed that out.

As hard as it is to believe, simple logic like that has no place on this thread :roll:

Semipropunter · January 2012

said:
if you reckon you saw it then YOU ARE A LIAR......100%

Well the main protagonist of this thread later admitted he had a prior gripe with stewards :!:

carey · January 2012

said:

said:
if you reckon you saw it then YOU ARE A LIAR......100%
Well the main protagonist of this thread later admitted he had a prior gripe with stewards :!:

and what has that got to do with the price of milk, and you never seeing what happened, regardless of what you may say?

Semipropunter · January 2012

said:

said:

said:
if you reckon you saw it then YOU ARE A LIAR......100%
Well the main protagonist of this thread later admitted he had a prior gripe with stewards :!:
and what has that got to do with the price of milk, and you never seeing what happened, regardless of what you may say?

If McEvoy had carved the words "Kerrin was 'ere" into Waratah's Secret's hooves, I bet you'd still have doubs? :? I used the analogy earlier on this thread of a man on trial for robbery who admits to his crime, but the prosecution admits to losing the CCTV footageof the crime. Does the jury now accquit the defendant even though he has admitted guilt?

carey · January 2012

well i don't know what happened(and neither do you).
but if you think those riders would know exactly what happened, and how, and could detail it perfectly, then YOU ARE DREAMING.
i don't think mcevoy was the cause, but, JUST LIKE YOU, i don't really know, and i doubt mcevoy does either.

Semipropunter · January 2012

said:
well i don't know what happened(and neither do you).
but if you think those riders would know exactly what happened, and how, and could detail it perfectly, then YOU ARE DREAMING.
i don't think mcevoy was the cause, but, JUST LIKE YOU, i don't really know, and i doubt mcevoy does either.

I reckon Harvey would know if McEvoy caused the interference and he didn't hesitate in protesting. Shaun O'Donnell needed to see the patrol film because he was so far back he couldn't see where the interference came from.

dungy · January 2012

said:

said:

said:

said:

said:
Well well the magic millions upheld protest was much worse, :?
why was it much worse??

you may not agree with the decision, BUT, at least they had the vision to enable them to come to their decision.
wa stewards did it with no such help.
Luckygray should have beaten He's Remarkable on the track, can you say that about Driefontein? He was tiring- Berry would not have got anything else out of his horse had he used the whip anyway, hands and heels would have been the go. The difference in prizemoney($840,000) is the reason for the protest and Berry gets an extra $42k of that.
if lucky gray wins or not is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT, because stewards had no evidence that he's remarkable was the cause.
as for the protest today, i'm not sure which way it should have went, but rawiller never stopped riding despite going sideways, which probably counted against him.
i certainly don't think it's remotely as controversial as the wa one.
Paul Harvey said McEvoy shifted out in front of him and McEvoy himself admitted he did. Case closed. You can see the shift from the side on shot. It's not as conclusive as a head on view but it's good enough imo. Berry said he put his whip away at the 200m mark in the MM. That was a lie, but neither Nash, nor the owners' representative of No Looking Back pointed that out.

Harvey was in there batting for SOD matey matey those boys locals looking after locals :wink: :wink:

Radman · January 2012

Gotta love this thread.

I can't believe that protest was upheld today.

So looking forward to the 24th when we can bump this thread again. :D

ICE · January 2012

said:

said:

said:

said:
Well well the magic millions upheld protest was much worse, :?
why was it much worse??

you may not agree with the decision, BUT, at least they had the vision to enable them to come to their decision.
wa stewards did it with no such help.
head on vision same same as Perth has :wink:
well i'll break my rule and respond to you......you don't know what you're talking about.
there was no problem seeing what happened on the gold coast, they had vision showing what happened, whether the decision was right or not is a different topic
there was no vision in wa that showed what happened(head on or otherwise)

He knows a great deal more then you would ever know about horse racing C 8) The rear vision view is the way to go :wink:

FearlessKat123 · January 2012

Harvey is one of the best ,he knows how to pocket a Jock on the rail on the corner WTF KM was doing i have no idea 10m more and his race was shot so he forced his way out of Harvey`s Pocket in doing so nearly bringing down the field-closed case you break the rules -take it on the Chin and get on with Life 8)

darkshines · January 2012

All that can be said to those still in protest denial is . . . . . please continue to bet up :D

Unknown · January 2012

said:

said:

said:

said:

said:

said:
Well well the magic millions upheld protest was much worse, :?
why was it much worse??

you may not agree with the decision, BUT, at least they had the vision to enable them to come to their decision.
wa stewards did it with no such help.
Luckygray should have beaten He's Remarkable on the track, can you say that about Driefontein? He was tiring- Berry would not have got anything else out of his horse had he used the whip anyway, hands and heels would have been the go. The difference in prizemoney($840,000) is the reason for the protest and Berry gets an extra $42k of that.
if lucky gray wins or not is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT, because stewards had no evidence that he's remarkable was the cause.
as for the protest today, i'm not sure which way it should have went, but rawiller never stopped riding despite going sideways, which probably counted against him.
i certainly don't think it's remotely as controversial as the wa one.
Paul Harvey said McEvoy shifted out in front of him and McEvoy himself admitted he did. Case closed. You can see the shift from the side on shot. It's not as conclusive as a head on view but it's good enough imo. Berry said he put his whip away at the 200m mark in the MM. That was a lie, but neither Nash, nor the owners' representative of No Looking Back pointed that out.
im not intersted in the gold coast one, but the perth one is VERY interesting and very wrong.
what harvey said is irrelevant, because wtf would you expect him to say.
mcevoy is another case and he was probably the cause of the protest being upheld, but i'm sure he was confused.
he did shift out and it probably warranted a suspension, BUT the damage to ws occurred prior to that.
i will also say that anybody that says they could see what happened in perth is a LIAR

man of many talents, you say McEvoy was confused...a mind reader or fortune teller? :wink:

Semipropunter · January 2012

said:

said:

said:

said:

said:

said:
Well well the magic millions upheld protest was much worse, :?
why was it much worse??

you may not agree with the decision, BUT, at least they had the vision to enable them to come to their decision.
wa stewards did it with no such help.
Luckygray should have beaten He's Remarkable on the track, can you say that about Driefontein? He was tiring- Berry would not have got anything else out of his horse had he used the whip anyway, hands and heels would have been the go. The difference in prizemoney($840,000) is the reason for the protest and Berry gets an extra $42k of that.
if lucky gray wins or not is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT, because stewards had no evidence that he's remarkable was the cause.
as for the protest today, i'm not sure which way it should have went, but rawiller never stopped riding despite going sideways, which probably counted against him.
i certainly don't think it's remotely as controversial as the wa one.
Paul Harvey said McEvoy shifted out in front of him and McEvoy himself admitted he did. Case closed. You can see the shift from the side on shot. It's not as conclusive as a head on view but it's good enough imo. Berry said he put his whip away at the 200m mark in the MM. That was a lie, but neither Nash, nor the owners' representative of No Looking Back pointed that out.

he did shift out and it probably warranted a suspension, BUT the damage to ws occurred prior to that.

This is the LIE. You are referring to the moment when McEvoy takes advantage of the carnage as gets off the rail when Big Ted hangs out. HE DID NOT GET SUSPENDED FOR THIS. He was suspended for his action prior to this where he shifts out, bumps WS which stumbles back and to the right. Yes he rolls back towards the rail after this, BUT that is bacause he bumped into a 500kg horse for god's sake.

Semipropunter · January 2012

said:

said:

said:

said:

said:

said:
Well well the magic millions upheld protest was much worse, :?
why was it much worse??

you may not agree with the decision, BUT, at least they had the vision to enable them to come to their decision.
wa stewards did it with no such help.
Luckygray should have beaten He's Remarkable on the track, can you say that about Driefontein? He was tiring- Berry would not have got anything else out of his horse had he used the whip anyway, hands and heels would have been the go. The difference in prizemoney($840,000) is the reason for the protest and Berry gets an extra $42k of that.
if lucky gray wins or not is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT, because stewards had no evidence that he's remarkable was the cause.
as for the protest today, i'm not sure which way it should have went, but rawiller never stopped riding despite going sideways, which probably counted against him.
i certainly don't think it's remotely as controversial as the wa one.
Paul Harvey said McEvoy shifted out in front of him and McEvoy himself admitted he did. Case closed. You can see the shift from the side on shot. It's not as conclusive as a head on view but it's good enough imo. Berry said he put his whip away at the 200m mark in the MM. That was a lie, but neither Nash, nor the owners' representative of No Looking Back pointed that out.
Harvey was in there batting for SOD matey matey those boys locals looking after locals :wink: :wink:

His testimony mave have indeed helped SOD, but Harvey protested immediately and why wouldn't he? What would you do if some idiot on the road pulled across in front of you without indicating and you ran right into the back of him? This is what Kerrin did-he didn't even look before angling out. Those who becry the lack of head on footage are being ridiculous. It's like a witness to a bar fight saying: "Yes, I saw the alleged attacker throw a punch from infront of the victim, I saw the victim fall back, but no, I didn't see the exact moment of impact. So no I can't be 100% sure the alleged attacker punched the victim. :roll:

carey · January 2012

said:

said:

said:

said:

said:
Well well the magic millions upheld protest was much worse, :?
why was it much worse??

you may not agree with the decision, BUT, at least they had the vision to enable them to come to their decision.
wa stewards did it with no such help.
head on vision same same as Perth has :wink:
well i'll break my rule and respond to you......you don't know what you're talking about.
there was no problem seeing what happened on the gold coast, they had vision showing what happened, whether the decision was right or not is a different topic
there was no vision in wa that showed what happened(head on or otherwise)
He knows a great deal more then you would ever know about horse racing C 8) The rear vision view is the way to go :wink:

fair enough numbnuts, you have to stick up for your mates i suppose.

i don't doubt he would know much more than i about horses(as would nearly everybody), but you would have no idea what i know about "racing".
racing is not even about horses, although i'm guessing you're nowhere near smart enough to realise that.

carey · January 2012

you need to stop coming up with idiotic analogies semi pro(
:lol: :lol:), they don't apply.

and PLEASE tell me exactly where it was that big ted was laying out(rather than in).

Semipropunter · January 2012

said:
you need to stop coming up with idiotic analogies semi pro(
:lol: :lol:), they don't apply.

and PLEASE tell me exactly where it was that big ted was laying out(rather than in).

shifting out is probably more correct. BT shifts out creatring the gap and McEvoy takes the hole. The gap--and the interference was created by Kerrin's initial move. The defence you are using that McEvoy was on the rail before he went throught that gap is totally misleading. He shifted out, bumped into WS which stumbles badly, then shifted back to the rail because THERE WAS A BLOODY HORSE IN HIS WAY.

carey · January 2012

said:

said:
you need to stop coming up with idiotic analogies semi pro(
:lol: :lol:), they don't apply.

and PLEASE tell me exactly where it was that big ted was laying out(rather than in).
shifting out is probably more correct. BT shifts out creatring the gap and McEvoy takes the hole. The gap--and the interference was created by Kerrin's initial move. The defence you are using that McEvoy was on the rail before he went throught that gap is totally misleading. He shifted out, bumped into WS which stumbles badly, then shifted back to the rail because THERE WAS A BLOODY HORSE IN HIS WAY.

i just looked to refresh my memory and perhaps you need to too!!

big ted was hanging,laying, shifting(call it whatever you like) IN, the only time it went out was when mcevoy shifted out abrubtly( and that was AFTER the damage that had occurred).
and again you are implying stuff that didn't happen(or if it did was not visible), so don't crap on to suit your argument.
this whole post of yours is factually bullshit written to support what you want to believe, rather than what you saw(which was sweet fa)

Semipropunter · January 2012

said:

said:

said:
you need to stop coming up with idiotic analogies semi pro(
:lol: :lol:), they don't apply.

and PLEASE tell me exactly where it was that big ted was laying out(rather than in).
shifting out is probably more correct. BT shifts out creatring the gap and McEvoy takes the hole. The gap--and the interference was created by Kerrin's initial move. The defence you are using that McEvoy was on the rail before he went throught that gap is totally misleading. He shifted out, bumped into WS which stumbles badly, then shifted back to the rail because THERE WAS A BLOODY HORSE IN HIS WAY.
i just looked to refresh my memory and perhaps you need to too!!

big ted was hanging,laying, shifting(call it whatever you like) IN, the only time it went out was when mcevoy shifted out abrubtly( and that was AFTER the damage that had occurred).
and again you are implying stuff that didn't happen(or if it did was not visible), so don't crap on to suit your argument.
this whole post of yours is factually bullshit written to support what you want to believe, rather than what you saw(which was sweet fa)

Ok, so you don't see McEvoy take a half look at shifting out moments before the interfernce until Westriver Kevydon rolls in and keeps him on the rail? You don't see McEvoy shift out precisely before the interference? I don't need to take a look at the film midway through my argument, but you obviously do. You have to be two lengths clear before shifting ground for a reason. McEvoy didn't even look. It might not have been an "abrupt" shift but it was enough to cause the interference. WS stumbles to the outside. Now, I'm no physics expert, but if someone pushes you from the front, you will usually stumble backwards, right? You want to see a head on vision where the contact occurs and that is never going to hapopen-there is no Zupruder's film on this incident.

DamienWyer · January 2012

I think the appeals board will support the Stewards in this decision. However I think the way in which evidence was taken will claim a victim, but in the end I don't think it will change the outcome of the race.

Looking again at the sequence of photo's I took, and watching the televison coverage, I find it difficult to understand how adamant the Stewards were in their finding. Perhaps the patrol film displays it quite clearly, as I have been told by one of the Owners of Luckygray.

In the end we need to move on. This race is not a Stallion making race by any stretch of the imagination, the NZ'ers need to understand that if they are pinning their hopes of commercial success on a victory in Perth, then they are very mistaken.

G'day Punter!

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