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Old Trots Bookies Names

Harness & Greyhounds
JayJayJayJay    8,267 posts
Harness & Greyhounds
Ernie Manning grabbed me the other night and asked for names of past Trots Bookies around the time of betting supervisor Jack Ivankovich. Obviously, he hadn't been conversing with that very upright bastion of the community who tells me I am the definition of a miserable old man, such a qualified and well assessed opinion that I immediately made a booking down at the local Headspace.

Anyway, I digress. I have compiled a list but the timelines and location become a bit blurred with time (and age) and some of these may or may not have been there at the time, some might have been gallops only operators but if others can assist, that would be welcome. Not sure what Ernie has in mind but he apparently does a history segment on some radio station that I can't pick up down here. I seem to recall a ring of roughly 30 bookies, maybe more on big nights with some of the gallops operators doing double duty. Feel free to pick the list to pieces. Here goes.

Manual Kalaf, Steve Mulhall,  Ian (and Sylvia) Boylan,  Ross Cooper, George Truscott, Terry Boylan, George Davies, Joe Rosich, Sam Nicholaides, Eric Mack, Bill Mack, Rod Evans, Don Mack, Francy Friedlander, Eric Wilson, Brett lenton, Bruce Atkinson, Ray Manolas, John Sarre, Clive Hills, Gordon Lennox, Kieran Glynn, Ray Lucev, Bob Howatt, Neville Hebbard, Charlie Osmetti, Rod Wilson, Kim Hunter, Roy Willison, Spiro Mallis, Kingsley Sanford, Lew Lewis.

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Comments

  • JayJayJayJay    8,267 posts
    Keith Nixon, Barry Matkovich.

    JimmyPop, bookielover likes this post.

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  • PackedMetalPandaPackedMetalPanda    170 posts
    Dave Poletti, Peter Ensel

    Those were there in recent years that I can recall.

    JimmyPop, bookielover likes this post.

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  • curmudgeoncurmudgeon    2,417 posts
    edited September 2022
    Charlie Osmetti from that list was my first senior football coach. A terrific person who engendered great respect in his sporting endeavours & as a leader of men. Played for South Fremantle in the WAFL & was a very good cricketer. Went on to become a school teacher & fielded at the Kalgoorlie races for years before filling a role as the Regional Education Officer based in Esperance where he also stood with the satchel. Last I heard he was retired from the Education Dept & was curator of the Esperance Bay Turf Club but that was a while ago now. His brother John was also a schoolteacher & bookmaker on the goldfields becoming principal of a couple of primary schools. In the absence of other evidence I should imagine they would both be still enjoying a punt. Osmetti is a legendary & revered surname at the Mines Rovers Football Club in Kalgoorlie

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  • ChariotsonfireChariotsonfire    3,001 posts
    I don't think Keith Nixon ever fielded at the trots. Owned quite a few horses trained by Fred Kersley but was solely an Enclosure Bookmaker at the races.My list of bookmakers that fielded at GP over that period:
    Bruce Atkinson, Bob Beavis, Ross Cooper, Alan Croll, Ron Duzevich, Rod Evans, Kieran Glynn, Mark Hayter, Bob Howat, Kim Hunter, Manuel Kalaf, Brett Lenton, Don Martin, Peter Morley, Sam Nicholaidis, 

    Others that also fielded at GP just before Jack Ivankovich became Betting Supervisor:
    George Davies, Morris Ellson, Kevin Jones, Ray Lucev, Eric Mack, Bill Mack, Vin Miles, Frank Proctor, Kingsley Sanford, Peter Quinn, John Kirkpatrick, John Squarcini, Terry Rohde, Kevin Hayes, Ernie Richardson, George Truscott, Peter Brown, Sylvia Boylan, Bruce Abbott, Clive Hills, Nick Botica, Bob King, Lou Lewis, Ray Manolas, Arthur Barrett, Ken McKee, 

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  • JayJayJayJay    8,267 posts
    Prior to Jack, who was the betting supervisor? Charlie Skehan was course security? "Mr Greensleeves" over the PA?

    bookielover likes this post.

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  • VillageKidVillageKid    2,346 posts
    Charlie Skehan & Jack Ivankovich are both well known names from the Perth Football Club.

    JayJay, bookielover likes this post.

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  • JayJayJayJay    8,267 posts
    In Jacks case, Manning Junior Football Club. I worked with Jack at Kent Street High School, circa ....ummm....1979?
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  • ChariotsonfireChariotsonfire    3,001 posts
    Charlie Skehan was also Mr Saver but was never betting supervisor.

    Graeme Bennier may have been the betting supervisor immediately prior to Jack.


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  • JayJayJayJay    8,267 posts
    1974 Inters W.M.Maloney
    1982 Inters Graeme Bennier
    1989 Inters Jack Ivankovich

    bookielover likes this post.

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  • savethegamesavethegame    3,067 posts
    Was Robbie Waterhouse issued a licensed to field at GP. when he was barred elsewhere ----thinking he never
    actual swung a satchel?. Not sure of the timing but he also got bookmakers license in NZ he was the only bookmaker in NZ ? Seemed odd

    bookielover likes this post.

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  • ChariotsonfireChariotsonfire    3,001 posts
    Father Bill fielded at Binshaw's inters but Robbie was never issued with a licence at GP.

    Robbie approached me through a third party to do some business when I was fielding in the Interstate Ring at Ascot when he was disqualified. I politely declined.

    Bob Meyers was granted permission to attend meetings at GP when he was barred from the races and George Way was also granted a licence to train when disqualified from the races.

    It would not have been possible for a disqualified bookmaker to field anywhere in Australia.

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  • JayJayJayJay    8,267 posts
    Honest Rob got a one off license to field in NZ shortly after he got his license to field back in 2002, at the Te Rapa carnival in the Waikato. It was a one off promotion as such. That is according to that dreadful "Rose Colored Glasses" Bill Waterhouse book that I regret spending $30 bucks on buying.

    I have a vague memory of Charlie Skehan escorting George Way from the betting ring at GP one night, right out through the Heritage Gates, during the time that George was disqualified for whatever it was. I think he is still warned off for life?

    One can only hope that the connections of Binshaw significantly lightened Waterhouse's satchell at the 67 Inters, in the days when Harold Park was said to be in the grip of organised crime and Waterhouse was the biggest trots bookie in the Rum Rebellion.

    bookielover likes this post.

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  • MarkovinaMarkovina    3,127 posts
    Seeing Harold Park has got a mention - there was a bookie their - allways very well dressed - alah Russel Roberts - and  that was the former top tennis player - Warren Woodcock - i think he played Davis Cup for Australia 

    Him and his son were doubles bookmakers - and  honestly it was like  a mathematical exhibition - they had 6 big white boards - with all the double combination odds - covering HP and all the interstate Trots and Dogs on that night

    And seeing R and W Waterhouse have been mentioned - i would love to be told what actually happened with Fine Cotton  - who organised it - the public havent been told what actually happened - the intricate details

    Bill Waterhouse was no saint - but he wasnt dumb enough to be involved in that Fine Cotton fiasco - and interestingly - about 12mths after both Robbie and Bill got banned re Fine Cotton - HP said to Bill you are free to field here if you like ( he declined ) they didnt say that to Robbie though 

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  • MarkovinaMarkovina    3,127 posts
    Nick Botica - he was a taxi driver as well - i got a ride in his Cab going to work - this would be early 80s 

    He was a  jovial - pleasant natured bloke - and i said to him your that Trots bookie aernt you - and he said he was - but he had given it away at that point 

    But he said the previous  Frid - they ( must have been the other bookies ) invited him back for just 1 meeting - and im allmost certain it was at Richmond Raceway . And obviously he wasnt that sharp on the form at that point - and he said what use to happen - this is what he told me ( maybe Chariots could confirm this ) that each bookmaker in the ring had to open the market for 1 race . And the race he was designated with - there was a horse of Fred Kersleys - i can remember the horse - smart type - but i cant remember its name - and it was well down in grade - and Nick turned to me and said ( before he roared laughing ) - i opened it at 12-1 - it started 7 to 4 fave and bolted in 

    Another bookie who hasnt been mentioned - John Naglan - big bloke 

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  • JayJayJayJay    8,267 posts
    Yes, cheers Marko, John Naglan slipped by. List is taking shape for around that era. Still think keith Nixon may have fielded at big nights but may be mistaken. And some others mentioned probably before Jack, more likely mid 70's to mid 80's when I think I recall Greg Denham, Kieran Glynn and Rod White doing clerking  duties for some bookies?

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  • ChariotsonfireChariotsonfire    3,001 posts
    Yes John Naglan had retired much earlier.

    To prevent bookies sponging off those that did some form the bookie on stand 1 was responsible to be first up for Race 1 and so on with prices to be displayed immediately after correct weight from the previous race. 

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  • VillageKidVillageKid    2,346 posts
    edited September 2022
    After much digging just found a few of my old race books from the 1980s (circa 1986/87 - 1987/88 seasons) and within them the Bookmakers Enclosure Ring listings for meetings at both GP & RR, most have been covered up above-

    W.Mack
    R.Beavis
    R.Evans
    S.Nicholaidis
    B.Atkinson
    M.Kalaf
    H.Spalding
    B.Lenton
    R.Cooper
    R.Michelle
    K.Sanford
    E.Mack
    M.Ellson
    J.Naglan
    L.Kanther
    W.Mack
    P.Morley
    K.Glynn
    T.Miles
    J.Squarcini

    L.Kanther would possibly have been former 1981 Claremont Premiership player Lindsay Kanther if I am not mistaken? Later switched to Perth under Mal Brown and badly injured his knee in either his first or second game there from memory.

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  • VillageKidVillageKid    2,346 posts
    edited September 2022
    Yes, cheers Marko, John Naglan slipped by. List is taking shape for around that era. Still think keith Nixon may have fielded at big nights but may be mistaken. And some others mentioned probably before Jack, more likely mid 70's to mid 80's when I think I recall Greg Denham, Kieran Glynn and Rod White doing clerking  duties for some bookies?




    Was that the Greg "Venom" Denham the former football writer for a few rags JJ?

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  • ChariotsonfireChariotsonfire    3,001 posts
    Keith Nixon had a sports licence and fielded at GP during the week in that capacity. I can guarantee he never fielded on the trots.

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  • MSmcbrideMSmcbride Posts: 1
    Old Trots bookie Dave Whittle always had a humerous and entertaining manner of calling the odds-he once advertised in the West Aust sporting notices "Wanted to buy Bookies bag capable of holding $10,000 will purchase empty or full"

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  • MarkovinaMarkovina    3,127 posts
    I wonder if any of these WA Bookies - were amateur psychologists - as in when they were on their bookies stands -  did they consistently yell out anything to the punters - to entice them to bet

    There was a bookie at Harold Park - senior bloke - about 55-60 years of age - and in a deep confident voice - on his bookie stand - he would consistently yell out - Board odds i lay - who knows them - Board odds i lay - who knows them !!!

    bookielover likes this post.

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  • ChariotsonfireChariotsonfire    3,001 posts
    MSmcbride said:

    Old Trots bookie Dave Whittle always had a humerous and entertaining manner of calling the odds-he once advertised in the West Aust sporting notices "Wanted to buy Bookies bag capable of holding $10,000 will purchase empty or full"

    Actually purchased my first bookies board off Dave. Went around to his house one Sunday morning morning and he was in his dressing gown with an aviator's hat on and a glass of whisky in front of him. Asked me if I had another form of income and when I said yes he agreed to sell me the board. Told me he had to jump on the bag to close it at Busselton meetings but those days were long gone. When charged with SP Bookmaking he went to court with a suitcase and asked the judge to send him to farm facility as he loved animals.

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  • getthechangegetthechange    339 posts
    Chariotsonfire said:

    Charlie Skehan was also Mr Saver but was never betting supervisor.


    Graeme Bennier may have been the betting supervisor immediately prior to Jack.


    Mr Saver(always thought it was Mr Sabre) was marching a couple of guys off the course at GP after a demonstration when one of the characters of the industry in George James repotredly called out
    You should be on the outside throwing them in not on the inside throwing them out
    and
     one of my fav bookie quotes was "anyone that believes cheats never prosper has never been om a race track"

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  • TheDivaTheDiva    13,248 posts
    Rod Evans.
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  • getthechangegetthechange    339 posts
    Greg Oneill and Terry French (owned Sir David) may/may not have fielded when two or three bookies were down near where the horses go onto the track - could also be wrong era

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  • JayJayJayJay    8,267 posts
    There was a supplementary ring next to the escalator on big nights at one stage. Backed Go To It one night in the main ring at 8/1.....was riding the escalator upstairs to watch and saw 16/1, turned around ran backwards and got 320/20....never forgotten that bet. Jimmy The jet did the rest. I can also recall a few fielding down where they go onto the track but no names come to hand. Sir David....Kevin Batt....won stacks of races.
    Demonstrations...a thing of the past....if you tried it on nowadays, a couple of those security agents in high viz might have to do something other than play with their phones all night whilst marshalling the non existent patrons in front of the closed JP's bar.

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  • MarkovinaMarkovina    3,127 posts
    Re the supplementary ring 

    The only reason ( well i saw him at Bunbury 1 night as well ) i remember John Naglan - is it was a big night - probably a pacing cup - ok you walk through the main entrance - probably about 80 metres - till you get say within 10 metres of the end of the home straight - soo you still havent reached the grandstands - and your on the concrete area and John Naglan was fielding their - he was the only bookie their - had his bagman and penciller with him  and he was up on his stand 

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  • savethegamesavethegame    3,067 posts
    Rod Evans  late eighties he was claimed  for thousand at 33/1 horse called Bells are Calling----said to the punter if it wins I'll throw in a bottle of wine,sure enough it won, punter went to collect--Rod threw a hundred at him for the wine said hope you choke, and you will have to come back later for the rest.

    Another incident he had this horse at 4s rest of the ring was betting 5,6s--Punter went up to Rod seeing if he would bet 12 to 3----. Rod replied 24 to 6 if you like which was accepted. Before Rod could get runners into action to get the  cream ---As it was a preorganized plunge with punters waiting for Rod to accept the initial bet then others hit the other bookies.at the better odds

    When punter went to collect Rod said your alot cleverer then you look.

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  • bookieloverbookielover    2,657 posts
    Loved reading this stuff. I recall some of those bookies, particularly Manuel Kahlaf who I got to know quite well.  I recall a bookmaking partnership which went under in about 2008. I think they had an office at GP.

    Of all those names, only Steve Mullhall remains, and assuming he hasn’t given away fielding at GP, is only there at the big meetings.

    I reckon it’s a pity that today’s generation or more to the point those who became punters from around 1998 onwards, will never know how absolutely glorious it was to go to a race, trot or dog meeting, with a big bookies ring, big punters and great atmosphere.

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  • PictureSon1973PictureSon1973    143 posts
    Bookielover you’re correct the demise of the Bookmaker / Bookies ring is to the detriment of
    the Excitement of the Sport .for the non participant.
    The Excitement the Theatre of it all nothing gets me going more than a story of a Plunge it’s
    Addictive for me .
    The stories of guys in the 70s 80s betting what a House was in Value Balls , Big Balls
    from both Punter & Bookmaker
    Man v Man not Man v Algorithm as is the case know .

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